Should People Be Allowed to Live Permanently

**Starjots** · 10-07-2014, 04:42 PM

When I saw the title of another thread in the feed, I thought it was about this. Which seemed interesting.

Hypothetical Context #1 :

(1) Breakthrough discovery, published in scientific journals, outlines simple way to extend life by slowing aging process down by factor of 1000. The new compound, taken once is called 'Everlivium (TM)'.
(2) No known side effects
(3) Very cheap
(4) Does require small amount of material not found in nature or easily made but available from governments, say a super heavy element - fancy way of saying governments have control of the magic ingredient.

Hypothetical Context #2 :
Same as #1 except there is no way to control production of Everlivium, the magic ingredient is baking soda and something you can grow indoors in a closet under strong lights.

Hypothetical Context #3 :
Same as #1 except the pill is very expensive to make, $10,000,000 (Ten Million Dollars USD) each in any quantities.

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For any context (please specify so we don't get confused even more)
Should Everlivium(TM) be illegal, legal but controlled (ask your doctor) or legal with no restrictions?
Will Everlivium(TM) doom humanity or usher in a golden age?
What would you be willing to do to get your hands on Everlivium(TM)?
Should people be allowed to live permanently?

**Bartender** · 10-07-2014, 04:50 PM

If we can otherwise stop reproduction or limit it in some great way sure in the case of Hypothetical #2 in the others no.

**Vison** · 10-07-2014, 05:22 PM

I think it would be detrimental to the further development of the human race for all its members to achieve immortality at this time. Currently, humanity depends upon a relatively quick turn-over of generations where the newest is habituated to the temporary status quo and embracing newness only to be quickly replaced by the next generation pushing forward again. Rinse, wash, repeat.

A species of immortals would stagnant quickly and likely become conservative to the point of regressing. Monopolies and power structures would solidify and become immovable. The contract killing business would boom.

**Robcore** · 10-07-2014, 05:22 PM

Why stop/limit reproduction? If we give the Everlivium to 5 year olds, we could fit a freaking ton more people on the planet. Smaller cars, smaller meals, smaller houses....we could effectively miniaturize them and rule over them as immortal giants.

**stigmatica** · 10-07-2014, 05:35 PM

Originally Posted by Starjots;65883
(1) Breakthrough discovery, published in scientific journals, outlines simple way to extend life by slowing aging process down by factor of 1000. The new compound, taken once is called '[B

Everlivium (TM)[/B]'.
(2) No known side effects
(3) Very cheap
(4) Does require small amount of material not found in nature or easily made but available from governments, say a super heavy element - fancy way of saying governments have control of the magic ingredient.

Ok.. organizing my thoughts:

Hypothetical Situations:
Hypothetical 1: Everlivium is government controlled (in that it requires the resources of a gov to create).. NO backyard burgers.

Hypothetical 2: Everlivium is government controlled (but does not require resources of a gov to create).. backyard burgers all around and cheap!

Hypothetical 3: Everlivium is governement controlled (but does not require resources of gov to create).. backyard burgers only for the uber uber rich.. as in.. $10,000,000 USD each.

Questions:
Should Everlivium(TM) be illegal, legal but controlled (ask your doctor) or legal with no restrictions?

No restrictions, no control. The spice should flow!

Will Everlivium(TM) doom humanity or usher in a golden age?

Hyp 1 (No BYB's) - Dystopian future like George Orwell's "The Time Machine"? Or perhaps more along the lines of the talking heads of famous historical figures found in Futurama, only they're more than just heads in jars? This scenario is the toughest to predict. More likely, the government would get tied up in a bureaucratic debate over what to do with the stuff for so long that the world would end before a decision was made. A few lucky corrupt government employees/officials would smuggle the stuff for themselves and their families, and then make a killing selling it on the black market. Overtime, most of the lucky few would be found out by the community they live in, become too well known and eventually assassinated.

Hyp 2 (Free BYB's) - Holy shit. Famine, war, and chaos as populations swell. Eventually, individual freedoms would be squashed as a matter of survival. Corrupt governments would rise and fall, and history would keep repeating itself reverting back to the famine and war steps. Idealistically, at some point, say on history repeat number 3, people would catch on. Birth control would become a social standard. I suspect there would also be a high rate of acceptable suicide at some specific age, which might determine the rules of birth.

Hyp 3 (Expensive BYB's) - Probably the same as Hyp 1, only more prolific black market penetration.

What would you be willing to do to get your hands on Everlivium(TM)?

Hyp 1 (No BYB's) - Nothing
Hyp 2 (Free BYB's) - Very little.. but that would be enough apparently.
Hyp 3 (Expensive BYB's) - Again, probably nothing.

Should people be allowed to live permanently?

All Hyp's - Sure, why not. Would give us the potential to accomplish great things. Just not sure we would realise our potential, but I'm willing to take that risk.

..........

Personally... I'd wish for this stuff to not only allow you to live forever, but revert your physical body and mind back to it's prime. I mean, who wants to live forever in an 80 yo body?

**Starjots** · 10-07-2014, 08:07 PM

Personally, I'd take being 50 for the next 1000 years. In that time maybe they could reverse aging.

Should it be legal? Yes except for #3 where it should be a controlled substance. Making eternal life contingent on getting rich would seriously screw things up everything for everybody while only helping out a very small fraction of the world. I could see it turning into class warfare with most plebs getting exterminated if they don't win quickly.

It should also be absolutely illegal for anyone under 25 or whatever age people determine is when your brain is fully cooked and wired. Otherwise children would become pets as robcore points out.

Doom or Golden Age? Possible doom in the short term, Golden Age in the long term. Hyper population growth would be the first problem to solve - I imagine more people would want kids at some point just to have family in the long haul (sort of a here on earth Mormonism) since kids are only kids for 20 years, not too big an investment for relatives. Then these kids would want kids. Long term how much time would be saved having everyone learn the basics and then learn common sense the hard way only to die within a few decades. People would actually think about the long term, right?

What would you do to get? I wouldn't kill anyone, but I'd put a lot of energy into it.

**lethe** · 10-07-2014, 08:12 PM

On the subject of children:

What would happen if the pill didn't stop aging until 30 years after you have taken it, AND the day you take it you become sterile?

**Deckard** · 10-07-2014, 08:15 PM

Drug is free to everyone, but if you reproduce you forfeit your right to it.

It's a nice hypothetical but once we reach that level of medical tech it's a short skip & jump to uploading minds, at which point you'd be hard-pressed to justify such an inefficient claim on meatspace.

**Buddha** · 10-07-2014, 08:40 PM

People living forever will have a severe impact on society. It will stifle innovation. (People over 25 don't develop innovative, daring new ideas. A 70 year old still has the same dumb ideas he did when he was 25). It will severely decrease scientific progress. (Max Planck: "A new scientific truth does not triumph by convincing its opponents and making them see the light, but rather because its opponents eventually die, and a new generation grows up that is familiar with it."). It will permanently park wealth and resources.

I think the law of entropy makes living forever an impossibility. But I can conceive of people immortalizing their brains by uploading them into a computer. In which case society will keep them alive as long as they are of some benefit and unplug them when they've become outdated.

If this was a realistic possibility I would propose a council of "Elders". A limited number of people who are kept alive but whose numbers are kept in check. In order to allow a new person into this elite group one of them has to give up his/her place.