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Thread: Expressing Anger

  1. #31
    TJ TeresaJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by C.J.Woolf View Post
    That statement would have pre-empted many a relationship clusterfuck thread on INTPc had it been in the FAQ. (Never mind that nobody reads the FAQ.)
    Oddly enough, for once I was not thinking about my ISFJ boyfriend(/betimes lover).

    Dealing with irrational SJs is like it's own special category of rage/avoidance/pity/manipulation. Over time I've refined my strategy to 1) disengage - if he's angry, it's almost never because of what he thinks he's angry about; better to step back and try to uncover the core issue; 2) tough it out - at least for him, he has bouts of major insecurity, and the only thing for it is to show rather than say; 3) deflate - we've been in a good spot lately, and he trusts me, so when I tell him "I don't think you're really angry at me; you're just trying to pick a fight because of X" he listens and believes me.

  2. #32
    TJ TeresaJ's Avatar
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    Thinking about it some more... It's especially frustrating and overwhelming for me when it's not just the issue at hand but some deep, fundamental, irresolvable knot that I know I can't deal with.

    Like, with my sister, I don't want to argue with her because a) her automatic response to any aggression is to counter-attack with ten times the original aggression, b) it actually comes down to my opinion of her husband, which is that, at present, he is lazy and a mooch and that the two of them together feel entitled to so much in life without having to lift a finger. For one thing, regardless of her actual opinion, we both understand that it's her duty as a wife to defend her man. On top of that I'm worried that, deep down, she agrees with me, and acknowledging that would uncover some deep dark well of depression.

    On top of all of that, we're both in a very similar boat of receiving assistance from our parents, but my attitude toward receiving help is to be acutely aware of the charity and to limit the assistance as much as possible, while she just feels entitled to everything and asks for more.

    The whole thing is a mess and I just don't want to go there. If I can repress, vent, or otherwise lose this anger for a few more months, the situation should (hopefully) resolve itself.

  3. #33
    Hasta Siempre Madrigal's Avatar
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    I don't get angry at individuals as much as I get angry at situations, systems, injustice, etc.

    I actually have what I consider an inappropriately broad capacity for understanding and confraternization with people who have fuck all to do with me and who will most likely at some point down the road do or say something to make me regret ever having interacted with them. But when the duck finally walks like a duck I get angrier at myself more than anything, for having let them in somehow. I have an idealistic streak I can't really erradicate that leads me to believe we can rise above certain things we have been socialized to be.

    Most people think I'm very calm. But usually when people believe I'm angry, I'm just using very exagerated or extremist speech, which is a weakness of mine, but not an actual indication of rage or anything. I do occasionally feel rage, and when I do, it becomes very clear to me that I won't want to keep that inside me indefinitely, so I'll normally express my anger and take the confrontation to its final consequences. But this isn't a stage I enter very often. In any case, I'll rarely regret anything said in anger because that's precisely the shit that's true and genuine.

    Edit: I can think of expressions of anger where I have truly acted like an ass, and there's one recent example. I was on the phone following up on a client who owes me money since August, talking to the secretary. I guess something she said made things escalate rather quickly because at one point she said, "I'm going to have to ask you to calm down." I didn't calm down at all, but then I felt bad about it. So half an hour later I called her back specifically to apologize for the mistreatment, said she had nothing to do with it and I really regretted it. She was nice and said it was okay, don't worry, etc. (I'm aware of the fact that this was still unfair because it's not like she had the choice to decline my apology and tell me to fuck off, but what else can I do.) I didn't do it to get my money, she has absolutely no say in the matter, but I don't mind apologizing if I think I've acted like a shithead.
    Last edited by Madrigal; 02-05-2015 at 05:20 AM.
    Everything under heaven is in utter chaos; the situation is excellent. - Mao

  4. #34
    Dr.Awkward Robcore's Avatar
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    Anger is just the consequence of inflated/irrational desires/expectations. The feeling itself is a prompt...not necessarily requiring expression unless doing so expedites resolution of an issue(rare cases). Usually it disappears once you take measures to address the inflated desire/expectation...eg. when you educate someone, you can then expect more from them.

  5. #35
    Senior Member Linnea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robcore View Post
    Anger is just the consequence of inflated/irrational desires/expectations. The feeling itself is a prompt...not necessarily requiring expression unless doing so expedites resolution of an issue(rare cases).
    Some people seem to have the idea that easily expressing anger is a kind of virtue. And I mean just expressing it/venting without any expectation that anything will get better by it. The people I've come across who hold this idea don't seem to have other ways to deal with their anger. Perhaps it's easier to think they are being somehow authentic to themselves than to think that they might benefit in some way from learning to control their reactions.

    Myth #30 It's Better to Express Anger to Others than to Hold It in

    Does Venting Anger Feed or Extinguish the Flame?

    Did self-control go out of fashion with the Victorians and their zeal for it?

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Linnea View Post
    Some people seem to have the idea that easily expressing anger is a kind of virtue. And I mean just expressing it/venting without any expectation that anything will get better by it. The people I've come across who hold this idea don't seem to have other ways to deal with their anger. Perhaps it's easier to think they are being somehow authentic to themselves than to think that they might benefit in some way from learning to control their reactions.

    Myth #30 It's Better to Express Anger to Others than to Hold It in

    Does Venting Anger Feed or Extinguish the Flame?

    Did self-control go out of fashion with the Victorians and their zeal for it?
    I came across research that said that the popular "letting air out of a balloon" approach was based on Freudian ideas that have been disproven by experimental research. In other words, we now know it doesn't actually work that way, and it is ultimately self-reinforcing.

    There has been a general trend in the social sciences to focus strictly on external environmental factors (not that these are never relevant) at the expense of internal, individual factors.

    Quote Originally Posted by from the article
    Research suggests that expressing anger is helpful only when it's accompanied by constructive problem-solving designed to address the source of the anger.
    I've generally found this to be true. Anyone notice that I'm a lot less angry?
    Last edited by msg_v2; 02-05-2015 at 10:51 PM.

  7. #37
    Member Mxx's Avatar
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    From what I can tell, I can usually approach a situation that has made me angry in a calm (yet assertive), rational way about once or twice. But if it's a recurring situation that has yet to be resolved through reasonable negotiation, I can get quite ruthless in my expression of anger (which is almost exclusively verbal). The problem is that I can find immense satisfaction in that ruthlessness.

    In some ways, I think that I need to get better control over that, or tone it down a notch; but in others, I find that it is often really effective, which is slightly disturbing. I'd prefer resolution through calm and rational negotiations.

  8. #38
    Global Moderator Polemarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Polemarch View Post
    After exiting a relationship with an SFJ (and another relationship before that with a SxJ), I can tell you that your emotions will always get trumped by theirs. Anytime I was upset about something and told my ex, she would find a way to get twice as upset as I was about the fact that I'm upset, so we'd spend the rest of our time dealing with her feelings about my feelings, and none of the time dealing with the actual problem I reported.

    I can communicate about feelings, because I translate them into words and thoughts. That's the world I live in, words, thoughts, arguments, logic, discourse. But feelers - particularly SFJs - don't live in that world. For them, words and thoughts are the artificial, and feelings are the real. So the fact that they feel whatever they feel - that IS reality for them, it is the truth, the way, the life. And all of your words and thoughts about that are at best superfluous.

    My advice is to stay the fuck away from anyone who can't use their words, or anyone who can't think abstractly about a problem. That will drastically narrow the pool of people you can associate with, but whatever.

    Going back to the OP's initial prompt, I express my anger more openly than I suppose I should. Feelers tend to react strongly to my tone and demeanor, which comes across as either abrasive or intimidating, because they read the emotion and ignore the words or context. Thinkers - particularly NTs - tend to perceive me completely differently than SJs do. NTs usually see me as even keel and safe.
    HOOOOLY SHIT I was expressing anger when I wrote that

    But yeah I come across as an angry asshole and everyone always thinks I'm mad at them
    We didn't land on Plymouth Rock. Plymouth Rock landed on us.

  9. #39
    TJ TeresaJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Polemarch View Post
    HOOOOLY SHIT I was expressing anger when I wrote that

    But yeah I come across as an angry asshole and everyone always thinks I'm mad at them
    Haha I read the post you quoted like, "Yeah. That's it. That exactly right."

    Also, I am pissed.

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