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Thread: Telling someone to go to hell

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    Elitist Hipster Snake Champion Grape Jelly's Avatar
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    Telling someone to go to hell

    Sometimes you feel so angry with someone that no other phrase covers all the anger you feel. You don't literally want them to burn or go to hell.

    If there is a God, do you believe he would be able to differentiate between telling someone to go to hell because you're mad at them, or would he interpret it literally.

    I believe it's similar to saying God damnit and it's just a sort of curse word. Still feels wrong ever saying it nontheless especially to someone who believes in hell and may interpret it literally. Is it a sin? Maybe if you literally wanted some to go to hell. On the other hand, I think it communicates "I'm extremely mad at at you right now and you crossed the line." It's the ultimate expression of anger. And if you don't believe in hell. I don't think anyone ever really means it.

    I've said it twice in my life, and have always felt really bad, and struggled with the morals of it. I think it's only for when someone really pisses you off in a big way. I said it earlier tonight and I feel terrible. I said I'm sorry for what I said, that's just how angry I am in response to all this ridiculousness. I'm a ridiculous man, taking things to ridiculous extremes. I'm exceptionally rude to everyone around me because people are rude to me, but at the same time I try to be nice where I see fit, and use judgement. I apologized and may apologize again also for name calling. My back was against the wall.

    Have you ever said this to anyone? How did you or do you feel about it?
    Last edited by Grape Jelly; 08-26-2016 at 05:09 AM.
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  2. #2
    creator kali's Avatar
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    It's okay, God will review it on a case-by-case basis to see if the condemned person really is deserving of eternal torment. God is good like that.
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    singularity precursor Limey's Avatar
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    Hell, or purgatory, is a catholic church invention, created to frighten people into compliance by "putting the fear of god" (and the devil) into them. There's no reference to hell, or purgatory in the bible. It's entirely made up as a control tool and I believe it's not a very good thing to use to express dissatisfaction with someone since it relies upon them having certain beliefs, in addition to caring about your opinion, having morals and a sense of guilt.

    I once had a great comeback to one of my zealot baptist neighbors that told me I was going to hell for not attending church on Sundays. "I don't believe in that either".

    So, no. I would never tell anyone to literally go to hell. I think it says more about me than the message I would want to convey. I think the best way to convey the sentiment that I'm assuming you're after is by expressing disappointment. You build the person up by letting them know why you thought they were worthwhile, that they're capable of more, then you snatch them off that pedestal by telling them that they have failed to live up to a base standard of objective decency.

    There is an objective moral high ground, because religion and faith do not own morality. You can cast a wider net than invoking Catholic shame.

  4. #4
    Elitist Hipster Snake Champion Grape Jelly's Avatar
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    I believe Catholics mean it in the literal sense which I believe is wrong, but can hardly blame them since they're Catholics in the first place. They know not indeed. Hell is a derivitive of religion, but even the concept of hell I couldn't objectively wish on anyone. I believe God would understand it was a heat of the moment faux pas similar to "Eat shit" or the ultimate "Fuck you," but my morals feel guilt over the literal semantics. Sometimes it can get the point across, but I learned I want to stick to basic insults. That's just something I don't wanna mess with, especially with someone I care about. I feel bad being an asshole to my family, but I don't give a fuck about people in public, bitchy shade throwers. I relish it.
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    igKnight Hephaestus's Avatar
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    Are you concerned some deity is going to obey a command you gave to someone else? I'm suspending my disbelief for a moment. When you say "Go to Hell", you are telling a person to do a thing. You aren't calling on a deity to send them to hell. If you shouted, "get beaten by a cop!" at someone, even if you were in earshot of a police officer, would it make sense for that cop to perk their ears up and think, "duty calls" then proceed to whale on the person you shouted at because you called for it to happen?

    If you intended for a deity to step in, wouldn't it make more sense to address the deity rather than the person you wanted victimized by your anger? Instead, you've put the burden of completing that directive on the person you are angry at, and their obedience to such a command is completely on them.

    If you tell someone to "Eat shit" or "Go fuck yourself", are you equally concerned these events will happen?

    Another interesting observation--or at least I find it interesting--in the realm of myth and other fiction, sometimes being told to go to hell is actually literal and has none of the negative associations you're bringing to the table. Sometimes that's just where what you want is, so that's where you have to go to get it. And sometimes it's a metaphor to describe a literal place--somewhere that is just awful.

    What would you do, if you told someone to go to hell, and they looked you in the eye and calmly said, "I'm in no hurry to return"?
    --Mention of these things is so taboo, they aren't even allowed a name for the prohibition. It is just not done.

  6. #6
    Elitist Hipster Snake Champion Grape Jelly's Avatar
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    @Heph;

    Refering to the initial post on this thread:

    http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/...d.php?t=281790

    I can't take it literally because I hardly have the power to condemn anyone like the Catholics. It's just kinda harsh. You have a good point though. It's just words and common Kardashianism. We all say something cruel and heartless at some point and end up regretting it. It's the nature of relationships and a part of life. We feel guilt, we feel human. Rationally, I know what I meant, I clarified and apologized. Just a bit harsh lol
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    fluff2fluff GnarlFox's Avatar
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    If there is a god, and there is a hell, he/she/it sure is stupid/mean/etc.

    I prefer "Go fuck yourself." I nearly told it to some lady in Walmart a few weeks ago. Basically, I had just waited an hour at Sam's club for them to install my car battery. I wasn't happy about it because I had bought it earlier and the guy there didn't feel comfortable doing it because my air intake is located on top of the battery. So this was the second trip. Still, it got done, and I proceeded to go to Walmart because I needed an oil change. My car has A/C that lowers the temp by about 4 degrees. I waited in my car twenty minutes before I was taken care of in 105 plus weather. Then I waited for about two hours during which my phone died. I decided to buy some cigarettes which I wasn't planning on because I was sure that my car would be done soon. But anyway, it was taking too long. I went to the cigarette aisle, which was a fast lane, but it had two of the oldest cashiers and slowest incidentally I've seen working it. I waited fifteen to twenty minutes. As I'm nearing the front of the line which had two cashiers as stated before, I asked the person in front of me if they wanted to go to the one in front to save some time. She pointed out that this lady in her late thirties had cut in line and was at the front register. At that point, I didn't give a fuck, and that's what I said. I walked up, put my stuff down in front of hers, and pointed to the people behind her and said, "You see those people? They've been waiting there for a long time. She was dismissive. Then I said about the same thing and pointed to the people in line. She then asked the clerk if both registers were in the same line. The clerk said they were. She said, "Oh. I didn't know." Then looked at me and said, "You didn't have to be so fucking rude about it. I just started shaking. I was very close to telling her to go fuck herself, but I wasn't in my element obviously so I just ignored her and made my purchase. I went back to automotive, and waited some more. When I got home, it had taken me about four and half hours to change my battery, oil, and stop by a watch repair store. All that after work. I should have said it. I really wish I had said it.
    The idea that there is more is essential to our humanity.

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    fluctuating Obfuscate's Avatar
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    biblicaly speaking:

    if there is a hell, it hasn't started yet... judgement is supposed to be reviewed by people like us... would you speak up if that was the only thing damning someone to the place? i think that diction won't be sending anyone there... i would also like to note that the word used for the lake of fire is the same one used for sodom and gomorrah... have you heard of two cities that just won't stop burning? it is also mentioned that they will be ashes under "our" feet... i think that there is a lot of defamation of God's character...

    bible aside:
    if it pops out of your mouth there must have been a good reason, unless you make it a part of your daily speech... reserve it for when you need it most, and try not to sweat the small shit...
    "The vanity of intelligence is that the intelligent man is often more committed to 'one-upping' his opponent than being truthful. When the idea of intelligence, rather than intelligence itself, becomes a staple, there is no wisdom in it."
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  9. #9
    Senior Member Spartan26's Avatar
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    DISCLOSURE: Iím gonna answer w/some biblical passages since you put this in Philo & Spirituality. All links are to bible verses, so no need to open them if you're just going to get sick of them. There's not a ton of them but more than I initially suspected when I thought about answering this post. It's a bit more "preachy" than even others of mine on spiritual matters but it looks like there's plenty of opposition already. I started this when there were only a few responses but the tally has grown since I was able to finish. I'll still play this straight.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grape Jelly View Post
    Sometimes you feel so angry with someone that no other phrase covers all the anger you feel. You don't literally want them to burn or go to hell.

    If there is a God, do you believe he would be able to differentiate between telling someone to go to hell because you're mad at them, or would he interpret it literally.
    I think the main thing I would focus on is where you are with your temper. Getting mad is one thing but how you handle it is the bigger concern.

    I donít want to oversimplify it but your initial question is brought up in the book of Jeremiah. There are verses about guarding the heart but it also says the heart is most deceitful above all else. Essentially saying, ďwe canít even know ourselves.Ē You can see what happens with the back verse linked. When Jesus says, ďout of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks,Ē itís a good indication that the way to prevent flair ups like you mentioned is to change whatís inside you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grape Jelly View Post
    I believe it's similar to saying God damnit and it's just a sort of curse word. Still feels wrong ever saying it nontheless especially to someone who believes in hell and may interpret it literally. Is it a sin? Maybe if you literally wanted some to go to hell. On the other hand, I think it communicates "I'm extremely mad at at you right now and you crossed the line." It's the ultimate expression of anger. And if you don't believe in hell. I don't think anyone ever really means it.
    As someone who believes in heaven and hell, (location & dimension notwithstanding), I donít believe man has the ability to send anyone to either place. (There are some times where curses and blessings had some profound effect on people mentioned in the bible but I think theyíre worth setting aside for your topic). I donít know if saying "go to hell!" is any worse than saying ďF. U.!Ē or ďBlow me!Ē

    It takes some time and may not sound sincere when you do it but offer a blessing when someone curses at you or makes you angry. Itís a habit I'd recommend to anyone wishing to change, the discipline of not retaliating when someone does something to make us upset. I wouldnít expect for that attitude to kick in right off the bat but Iíd say to pray for your enemies or those people who make you upset. The next step is to be in service to them. Thatís the thing that can really change you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grape Jelly View Post
    I've said it twice in my life, and have always felt really bad, and struggled with the morals of it. I think it's only for when someone really pisses you off in a big way. I said it earlier tonight and I feel terrible. I said I'm sorry for what I said, that's just how angry I am in response to all this ridiculousness. I'm a ridiculous man, taking things to ridiculous extremes. I'm exceptionally rude to everyone around me because people are rude to me, but at the same time I try to be nice where I see fit, and use judgement. I apologized and may apologize again also for name calling. My back was against the wall.
    To really change you have to be kind to the people who deserve it and those who donít. To those who are appreciative and to those who arenít. I understand that saying "go to hell!" is sorta the nuclear option in dealing with people but, as you've seen, it often makes the one who said it as upset as the one who hears it. Iím not nearly as sarcastic as I used to be, (thb, I sometimes miss that side of me - well, the dry cutting humor but Iím sure it was healthy to get a lot of anger inside of me out), but sometimes using sarcasm can be a step of saying what you want w/out permanently killing the relationship. Bridling (controlling) the tongue may be one of the most difficult things youíll have to do. That can be with friends, relatives, even work adversaries, you canít just let yourself go. At the old intpcentral I had one signature throughout that was kind of a life mantra. (Haha, anyone still reading remember vaguely what that was?!?!Ē)

    I guess you can say itís a good sign that you felt bad after it happened. I had a boss, ESxJ whoíd constantly blow his top. Usually it was his assistant who took the brunt of it. Other times it was negotiators from the other side. Sometimes heíd say things really bad and then later apologize and say he didnít mean it. I have an ESTJ friend who loses her sh#t quite frequently and I remember her saying she actually doesnít like being that person. Iíve known other people to say that. Kind of the obvious question to me is, ďwhy donít you change?Ē I donít know if theyíre saying what they do as a release or just trying to inflict damage on another. I think itís helpful to recognize the guilt you feel and that you want to move away from that pattern. As opposed to other people, like the ESTJ assistant to my former boss, whoíd like to scream at people or yell back at my boss and then justify why it was OK to say what she did later on. It just made her more bitter. I think youíre right to apologize and ask for forgiveness. Maybe remember this for when someone says something harsh to you. Even when youíre in the right to blow up at someone you canít let your hurt feelings or your pride dictate your actions. Emotion will reset back to zero on their own but even the most sincere apologies donít fix damaged relationships.

  10. #10
    Elitist Hipster Snake Champion Grape Jelly's Avatar
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    @Spartan26

    I actually like the bible verses.

    The Christian becomes an atheist, the atheist becomes spiritual, the spiritual becomes christian, who then is spiritual atheist. Most atheists are Christian, and to be spiritual you have to be an atheist to religion, but to be spiritual is to embrace religion from a poetic perspective. Live like an atheist, believe spiritually. To be spiritual is to take a universal approach, you know, beside religion, but to take a universal approach is to consider the merits of religion from a metaphorical perspective. Fortunately, the atheist in you isn't worried about any of this. The desire for truth is the motivating factor leading the christian to become the atheist, the atheist becoming the guru, leading the guru to embrace truths in the bible.
    Chocolate ding dong

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