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Thread: How can multiculturalism work if it supports cultures that reject multiculturalism?

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    Curious Conlanger epistemophiliac's Avatar
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    How can multiculturalism work if it supports cultures that reject multiculturalism?

    thoughts?

    For example, you have many immigrants coming into Europe (or the US, Canada, wherever), bringing their native cultures with them, and forming minority groups; different countries have different approaches to this from cultural and social assimilation to highly tolerant multiculturalist views. In the case of the latter, what if the immigrants' culture is intolerant to multiculturalism? It seems a bit paradoxical.

    Also, what about the cultures of aboriginal minorities that reject multiculturalism (perhaps in order to preserve their own heritage) (i.e. the Apache nation, Maori, etc)? And what about different cultures that share official status in a state, yet one may reject multiculturalism to an extant in order to preserve their own language/heritage/identity (i.e. French Canada vs English Canada, French Belgium vs Flemish Belgium, etc)?
    Pedin i phith in anÝron, a nin ˙-cheniog.
    Kup tar-tor n'zhitlar ik istau - eh ri ken-tor du nash-veh.
    Sa's drisa tonabhiala tomu˝ s'eph de'imal'il, sa se lodhe togal'n.
    B'lir inus vorbilim bi mek inus, hiam gi b'ek ilimlimr.

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    Senior Member Lurker's Avatar
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    Multiculturalism is a romantic utopian ideal that has been granted "realistic" status. It goes against our nature to welcome -- let alone embrace -- cultures that are strikingly different from our own, and often diametrically opposed to ours (whatever that identity may be). Religion is the greatest hurdle. If each religion is the One True Belief, then discord and outright hatred is unavoidable, as every group thinks they are right and thus superior and entitled.

    I think people need to focus on their similarities. That's more realistic.

    Tolerance passes for acceptance, and it's trendy and progressive for college kids to "embrace" different cultures, for what that's worth. Young children are truly open-minded, so maybe exposure to "The Others" is best done during youth. I think parents can have a huge impact by modeling what acceptance and kindness should be.

    I also think any culture that emphasizes "rights" and "individuality" over a prosocial (thus somewhat sacrificial) identity is already steeped in doubletalk. If one group is exceptional, that invites comparison, so how does equality even make sense? "Better but equal?" Nah.


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    TJ TeresaJ's Avatar
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    The idea is that the dominant, "tolerant" culture will gradually wear them (or their descendants) down.

    Also I'd say that there's a baseline of expectations. You may be an intolerant whatever-ist, but so long as you abide by these laws protecting individual freedoms, you're fine.

    I mean it is interesting how things actually play out. Culture clashes. Cultural evolutions. However I don't think that there's an irreconcilable paradox in tolerant cultures accepting immigrants from intolerant cultures. It can work to their advantage.

    Of course there are a lot of other factors at play as well. Economic bounty tends to lead toward decadence/tolerance in any culture, while the reverse is also true.

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    fluctuating Obfuscate's Avatar
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    how can it work if it doesn't? i view culture as a potluck... if i like what is there i'll take it, and if i don't someone else will take it or it will rot for all i care...
    "The vanity of intelligence is that the intelligent man is often more committed to 'one-upping' his opponent than being truthful. When the idea of intelligence, rather than intelligence itself, becomes a staple, there is no wisdom in it."
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    Senior Member Senseye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TeresaJ View Post
    The idea is that the dominant, "tolerant" culture will gradually wear them (or their descendants) down.
    At least that's what we hope.

    You have to ask: why have these folks left their culture in the first place? The answer is because their fucked up culture has led to dysfunctional institutions and a shit standard of living. Usually due to religious kookiness and/or sectarian nonsense of some sort. Of course, it's politically incorrect to say this and the products of that culture are usually too stupid to realize it (plus nobody ever admits responsibility for their own problems, that's just human nature anyways). So they try to bring their crappy culture along with them and the politically correct apologists encourage them.

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    malarkey oxyjen's Avatar
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    The majority culture that pushes muti-multiculturalism will always be able to dictate which part of the minority cultures are acceptable and unacceptable.

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    Member Thoth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxyjen View Post
    The majority culture that pushes muti-multiculturalism will always be able to dictate which part of the minority cultures are acceptable and unacceptable.
    You make that sound almost villainous... Nothing says, for example, a woman shouldn't hide herself so as not to tempt other men and give up education and civil liberties, in which case being part of the majority pusher culture is to one's benefit.

    I would say the kind of hypocritical multiculturalism "progressivists" push is indeed a paradox. How can a progressive, on one hand champion something like gender equality, whilst simultaneously being apologist for a culture that actively denies equality?

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    TJ TeresaJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thoth View Post
    You make that sound almost villainous... Nothing says, for example, a woman shouldn't hide herself so as not to tempt other men and give up education and civil liberties, in which case being part of the majority pusher culture is to one's benefit.

    I would say the kind of hypocritical multiculturalism "progressivists" push is indeed a paradox. How can a progressive, on one hand champion something like gender equality, whilst simultaneously being apologist for a culture that actively denies equality?
    This is the future liberals want.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TeresaJ View Post
    Thank you. I'm muslim. The quran says brides are of two types (think professions) wide eyed/sexy (and possibly loosely clothed) - i think also stupid like feminists, their like the weather. And the other kind are short....tempered/sighted and kind, devout religious wearing a headscarf out of piety and kind and intelligent.

    Peace

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    O mankind, indeed We have created you from male and female and made you peoples and tribes that you may know one another. Indeed, the most noble of you in the sight of Allah is the most righteous of you. Indeed, Allah is Knowing and Acquainted

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