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Thread: Christian says foetuses are going to hell forever

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    Married Mouth-breather JohnClay's Avatar
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    Christian says foetuses are going to hell forever

    I met a Christian in real life that I had debated on Facebook and then became his "friend" on Facebook. When we met we were talking about hell and he showed me Psalms 51:5 in his NIV Bible:
    "Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me."

    And as you know, sinners go to hell, and according to traditional Christianity, it goes forever. (see this sermon excerpt from my sister's pastor)

    He also talked about babies (and animals) being killed in the global Flood, Deuteronomy 20, and about Romans 5. He says babies aren't innocent and there is no "age of reason" (where you go to Heaven if you are young enough)

    A message he sent me:
    I certainly admit that in my natural thinking that babies don't deserve hell. The problem though is it's not what I think that really matters. It is what God says that is of importance. I am not at liberty to make Scripture say what I WANT it to mean. Rather I am called to take out of the text what it actually says.

    The problem is that my natural mind is going to naturally OPPOSE God. From God's perspective, I marvel that he saves anybody and why me? As he states in Romans 9, he has mercy on those HE CHOOSES to have mercy on and HARDENS those he chooses to harden. In any of this can it be demonstrated that God's judgement is lacking? Of course not, for His ways are infinitely higher than ours.

    Is God guilty of ANY injustice in this? Certainly not. He is the potter, the Creator; we are the pots, the created. I've never heard of a pot challenging its maker. So is God just in His judgements? I have to say yes.
    I invited that guy into my house - after all my housemates call themselves Christians. But they couldn't stand him and kept on giving me hints saying to me "it's getting late". Afterwards my brother in law got quite angry at me for daring to invite him in and my wife called him a "lunatic". After I told my wife the next day about his beliefs about hell she said he was crazy, a madman and a psychopath. I think he is psychotic though I still am interested in keeping in contact with him.
    Last edited by JohnClay; 06-30-2017 at 08:02 AM.

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    It becomes easier when you accept that it's all a myth.

    I almost feel like vomiting when I see religious people debate bible interpretations.

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    Married Mouth-breather JohnClay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scarydoor View Post
    It becomes easier when you accept that it's all a myth.
    I find his POV interesting though - he is the first person I've heard of who believes that about foetuses/zygotes....

    I almost feel like vomiting when I see religious people debate bible interpretations.
    I'm much more interested in them disagreeing than them agreeing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnClay View Post
    I find his POV interesting though - he is the first person I've heard of who believes that about foetuses/zygotes....
    There'll come a point when you'll realise the person is... basically intellectually retarded in some way.

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    Married Mouth-breather JohnClay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scarydoor View Post
    There'll come a point when you'll realise the person is... basically intellectually retarded in some way.
    He seems to be extremely talented at chess but he believes there have been 3-7 metre tall giant human bones found - even after I showed him 3 snopes.com links and this which is from an organisation that believes the universe is 6000 years old but that there is no hard evidence for giants.

    Some photoshopped images:




    BTW I told him I want to read "String Theory for Dummies" but he says that is a waste of time and that there is no evidence for string theory, etc. He thinks it is just an excuse to not believe in a Creator. He says that I can't be saved through using reason.

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    a fool on a journey pensive_pilgrim's Avatar
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    Okay but how bad is hell really going to be for a fetus? They don't really feel anything, right?

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    Married Mouth-breather JohnClay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pensive_pilgrim View Post
    Okay but how bad is hell really going to be for a fetus? They don't really feel anything, right?
    I think the guy believes the foetus would become an adult in hell - similar to how in a movie about Heaven a boy met his sister who had died as an infant or earlier and she could speak and was quite grown up.

    http://www.doctorsonfetalpain.com/fe...-the-evidence/
    A wealth of anatomical, behavioral and physiological evidence shows that the developing human fetus is capable of experiencing tremendous pain by 20 weeks post-fertilization.

    So that's at about the halfway point.

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    Bringer of Jollity MoneyJungle's Avatar
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    What does the zygote torturer in Hell do all day?

    I'd hit this guy with Matthew 18: 1-4

    At that time the disciples came to Jesus, saying, “Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?” 2 And calling to him a child, he put him in the midst of them 3 and said, “Truly, I say to you, unless you turn and become like children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. 4 Whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.
    All kids being like kids, although back in JC's* day kids weren't on the computer all day, all kids enter the K of H, no? Either that or the New Testament books (and Gospels in particular) are a little fuzzy on who is damned. You should invite this guy to the forum. We could use a good barn-burner vis-a-vis the unborn.

    *Jesus Christ. Not JohnClay.

    Glimpses do ye seem to see of that mortally intolerable truth; that all deep, earnest thinking is but the intrepid effort of the soul to keep the open independence of her sea; while the wildest winds of heaven and earth conspire to cast her on the treacherous, slavish shore?

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    a fool on a journey pensive_pilgrim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnClay View Post
    I think the guy believes the foetus would become an adult in hell - similar to how in a movie about Heaven a boy met his sister who had died as an infant or earlier and she could speak and was quite grown up.
    That's just silly. How would a fetus get the nutrients to develop and grow in hell? Isn't it just full of fire and demons? Is this fetus going to be nursed at some demonic tit? Or is that where demons come from, the aborted and miscarried fetuses that have grown up in hell?

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    Married Mouth-breather JohnClay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pensive_pilgrim View Post
    That's just silly. How would a fetus get the nutrients to develop and grow in hell? Isn't it just full of fire and demons? Is this fetus going to be nursed at some demonic tit? Or is that where demons come from, the aborted and miscarried fetuses that have grown up in hell?
    I'm quite sure he believes that the zygote or foetus would be mature in hell. I can't remember his specific words though. The subject title still is accurate - they were foetuses - they're just not necessarily still foetuses when they go to hell.

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