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Thread: The Masculinization of Society

  1. #21
    Meae Musae Servus Hephaestus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robcore View Post
    Wearing armor is not being vulnerable. Knowing about vulnerability is not the same as being vulnerable. Men are great at being guarded. Doesn't mean that they understand vulnerability.
    Disagree. To understand what to guard, you must know where you are vulnerable.
    Most of time, when people ask why something terrible happened, they don't realize they are looking for someone to blame.

    --Meditations on Uncertainty Vol ξ(x)

  2. #22
    Dr.Awkward Robcore's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hephaestus View Post
    Disagree. To understand what to guard, you must know where you are vulnerable.
    Seems like you're just being obtuse or playing devil's advocate for some weird reason. My point is that it is valuable to be vulnerable and exposed sometimes...and insisting that being guarded is equivalent to understanding vulnerability is silly and you know it.
    So much guardedness is just indoctrinated...it isn't like men all consciously evaluate their vulnerability before donning protective gear...it's generally mandated.
    Further, vulnerability is not just physical...it is emotional.

    There's some good stuff under your armor, and we do well to learn to expose it. Defending it so excessively makes it a liability rather than a benefit.
    ...the origin of emotional sickness lay in people’s belief that they were their personalities...
    "The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong." ~Carl Jung

  3. #23
    singularity precursor Limes's Avatar
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    When I go to Starbucks, I'm reminded of the masculinization of society, when I get a latte and put the paper-zarf, the "sleeve" on the cup. OH! really society? you want me to put this foreskin onto my cup, that's thicker at one end, and roll it up until it meets friction? REALLY?
    I will make a stand!...ooh! shit that cup's hot!

  4. #24
    Goon Roolz itch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Limes View Post
    When I go to Starbucks, I'm reminded of the masculinization of society, when I get a latte and put the paper-zarf, the "sleeve" on the cup. OH! really society? you want me to put this foreskin onto my cup, that's thicker at one end, and roll it up until it meets friction? REALLY?
    I will make a stand!...ooh! shit that cup's hot!
    This goes deeper than you think: I have a re-usable cup foreskin hand knit by a lady.
    stupid pancakes.

  5. #25
    Meae Musae Servus Hephaestus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robcore View Post
    Seems like you're just being obtuse or playing devil's advocate for some weird reason. My point is that it is valuable to be vulnerable and exposed sometimes...and insisting that being guarded is equivalent to understanding vulnerability is silly and you know it.
    So much guardedness is just indoctrinated...it isn't like men all consciously evaluate their vulnerability before donning protective gear...it's generally mandated.
    Further, vulnerability is not just physical...it is emotional.

    There's some good stuff under your armor, and we do well to learn to expose it. Defending it so excessively makes it a liability rather than a benefit.
    I honestly disagree. Vulnerability is like surgery: almost always bad, but occasionally necessary. To understand vulnerability is to avoid it.
    Most of time, when people ask why something terrible happened, they don't realize they are looking for someone to blame.

    --Meditations on Uncertainty Vol ξ(x)

  6. #26
    Dr.Awkward Robcore's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hephaestus View Post
    I honestly disagree. Vulnerability is like surgery: almost always bad, but occasionally necessary. To understand vulnerability is to avoid it.
    The handshake gesture exemplifies the benefit of vulnerability...to extend one's shield arm, exposing oneself...
    Some rewards take risk.
    ...the origin of emotional sickness lay in people’s belief that they were their personalities...
    "The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong." ~Carl Jung

  7. #27
    Meae Musae Servus Hephaestus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robcore View Post
    The handshake gesture exemplifies the benefit of vulnerability...to extend one's shield arm, exposing oneself...
    Some rewards take risk.
    I'm left-handed. And handshakes have given me warts. It wasn't worth the risk.

    Edit: also worth noting the vulnerability isn't extending your shield arm, but tying up your sword arm, so you can't attack.

    Though that adds Ehud to the list of male legends about the hazards of vulnerability.
    Most of time, when people ask why something terrible happened, they don't realize they are looking for someone to blame.

    --Meditations on Uncertainty Vol ξ(x)

  8. #28
    Goon Roolz itch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hephaestus View Post
    I'm left-handed.
    Sinister!
    stupid pancakes.

  9. #29
    Dr.Awkward Robcore's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hephaestus View Post
    I'm left-handed. And handshakes have given me warts. It wasn't worth the risk.

    Edit: also worth noting the vulnerability isn't extending your shield arm, but tying up your sword arm, so you can't attack.

    Though that adds Ehud to the list of male legends about the hazards of vulnerability.
    Are you happy, Heph? do you feel connected to other people? Is it possible to feel connected with other people and not be vulnerable/exposed? Perhaps as a caretaker, to some degree...but then such relationships usually end up fairly one-sided.
    ...the origin of emotional sickness lay in people’s belief that they were their personalities...
    "The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong." ~Carl Jung

  10. #30
    Meae Musae Servus Hephaestus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robcore View Post
    Are you happy, Heph? do you feel connected to other people? Is it possible to feel connected with other people and not be vulnerable/exposed? Perhaps as a caretaker, to some degree...but then such relationships usually end up fairly one-sided.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hephaestus View Post
    I honestly disagree. Vulnerability is like surgery: almost always bad, but occasionally necessary. To understand vulnerability is to avoid it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hephaestus View Post
    @Robcore, men have always known vulnerability. That's the point of Achilles, Sigurd, Heracles, and Agamemnon. It's the point of armour. Doubtless there are dozens of other significant examples, but those leap to mind.

    It's even in the lore of alcohol as liquid courage.

    I mention it because it's also the point of trust. Trust is not new. It's only slightly older than betrayal.
    .
    Most of time, when people ask why something terrible happened, they don't realize they are looking for someone to blame.

    --Meditations on Uncertainty Vol ξ(x)

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