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Thread: Can a Man and a Woman Be Friends?

  1. #11
    Sysop Ptah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sistamatic View Post
    Can humans learn to frame relationships as friendships in spite of attraction?

    The answer is that some can and some can't, but regardless of how attracted we are to someone, we are responsible for controlling our responses. (Response...responsible...not a coincidence).

    Things that affect the difficulty level may include cultural norms and expectations, experience, level of satisfaction with current relationship status, risk/reward calculations, etc.
    Bullshit qua irrelevant: all can and should control themselves, as such. Personal responsibility: get some. A "difficulty" is not an impossibility -- a "can't". Particularly not in the realm of self control, as such. Get a fuckin' grip, people.

  2. #12
    Homo siderius Sistamatic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ptah View Post
    Bullshit qua irrelevant: all can and should control themselves, as such. Personal responsibility: get some.
    lol...well I was implying that those who can't are not sentient...
    Insults are effective only where emotion is present. -- Spock, "Who Mourns for Adonais?" Stardate 3468.1.

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  3. #13
    Sysop Ptah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sistamatic View Post
    lol...well I was implying that those who can't are not sentient...
    Ha, well, or as I put it: emotionally immature/insecure. Honestly, people who think that friendship is precluded or complicated by attraction (mutual or otherwise) -- (and that's the "worst case", really -- just between men and women regardless of attraction) are effectively thinking (if not also living) at the level of children (if not merely animals), if you ask me. Grow the fuck up, folks.
    Last edited by Ptah; 12-11-2017 at 08:38 PM.

  4. #14
    Homo siderius Sistamatic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lilith View Post
    So, are you saying it is possible for a man and a woman to share so much of interests that they hang out at least a few times in a month and that each is welcome in each other’s house/apartment?
    My business partner/coauthor is a male. He lives nextdoor. We spend time together in each other's homes five days a week. We have been writing together for 8 years and are not and have not ever been romantically involved, nor have we ever had to make an effort to squash any feelings. He's my age, and he isn't fat or ugly. He's independently wealthy and has girlfriends who come and go. It's not an issue for me. It's all in how you allow yourself to frame it on day one. He's my husband's best friend. Getting to the point where there is an issue isn't something that happens in a single step. All you have to do is not take the first one.
    Last edited by Sistamatic; 12-11-2017 at 09:59 PM.
    Insults are effective only where emotion is present. -- Spock, "Who Mourns for Adonais?" Stardate 3468.1.

    I'm not avoiding socializing I'm helping socializing avoid me! --MoneyJungle

  5. #15
    Sysop Ptah's Avatar
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    As I see it, this boils down to whether you see other people as people first and principally, or as male or female (or whatever other categorical, such as this race or that, etc). If you can only see a man as a man, and not as a person, if you can only see a woman as a woman and not as a person, then you are bound to have all sorts of problems. So it goes for all such incomplete and/or inaccurate (if not also stereotypical) perceptions of basic daily realities. See also: wake the fuck up. People are people first. There is nothing in the distinction between (or unique natures of) men and women which runs preclusive or problematic to the conditions of/for (non-amorous) friendship proper. For the conditions and phenomena of friendship are based on essentially human factors, not gender specific factors. That is, shared values, trust, mutual respect, etc -- possible between any two people, any two human beings.

    To address the case of one friend being attracted to the other, say a man finds his friend, a woman, attractive. Insofar as he really is her friend -- hence, he respects her -- then it behooves him to keep his feelings in check (see also: elementary self-control, personal responsibility). It is one thing to feel a thing, it is a totally different -- volitional -- thing to act on it, or to allow it to color actions. Goes both ways. If a woman finds her male friend attractive, insofar as she really does respect him as a friend, she ought to keep it in check. Insofar as they "cannot find that possible", then they are governed by their feelings, and have some growing the fuck up to do, but meanwhile -- ought to go their own ways, as I see it. In this case, it is not being a man or a woman that runs preclusive to the friendship; it is one or both's lack of self-control -- hence breach of respect. A rather childish if not also sub-human/animal lack of control, I might add.
    Last edited by Ptah; 12-11-2017 at 08:45 PM.

  6. #16
    Senior Member Starjots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ptah View Post
    As I see it, this boils down to whether you see other people as people first and principally, or as male or female (or whatever other categorical, such as this race or that, etc). If you can only see a man as a man, and not as a person, if you can only see a woman as a woman and not as a person, then you are bound to have all sorts of problems.
    I've had this idea that some people don't see the opposite sex as being 'normal humans.' Your statement is much more coherent. I agree 100%.

  7. #17
    Homo siderius Sistamatic's Avatar
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    Culture can have a profound effect on the difficulty level of male-female friendships. If you are, for example, taught from birth that the sight of an unrelated female's ankle is grounds for rape and stoning, you are going to have less incentive to learn to respect them as people.
    Insults are effective only where emotion is present. -- Spock, "Who Mourns for Adonais?" Stardate 3468.1.

    I'm not avoiding socializing I'm helping socializing avoid me! --MoneyJungle

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starjots View Post
    I've had this idea that some people don't see the opposite sex as being 'normal humans.' This statement is much more coherent. I agree 100%.
    Sadly, as I've observed it -- those who only see genders or races rather than people are those who only see themselves in such terms.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sistamatic View Post
    Culture can have a profound effect on the difficulty level of male-female friendships. If you are, for example, taught from birth that the sight of an unrelated female's ankle is grounds for rape and stoning, you are going to have less incentive to learn to respect them as people.
    Once again:

    Quote Originally Posted by Ptah
    Bullshit qua irrelevant: all can and should control themselves, as such. Personal responsibility: get some. A "difficulty" is not an impossibility -- a "can't". Particularly not in the realm of self control, as such. Get a fuckin' grip, people.

  10. #20
    Homo siderius Sistamatic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ptah View Post
    Once again:
    Even so, I'm more wary around people with certain cultural backgrounds...i.e. pentecostals. If a guy says he can't be expected to control himself around me, I'm not going to miss the meeting, but I am bringing pepper spray.
    Insults are effective only where emotion is present. -- Spock, "Who Mourns for Adonais?" Stardate 3468.1.

    I'm not avoiding socializing I'm helping socializing avoid me! --MoneyJungle

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