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Thread: free will

  1. #1
    Member mark esparza's Avatar
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    free will

    What would happen if everyone knew free will was not real?

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    Dr.Awkward Robcore's Avatar
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    On the one side, entertaining a hypothetical when you don't believe in free will is hilarious.
    On the other, you know that the answer is "whatever naturally follows from antecedent events".

    ...but maybe you're wondering if the existence of consciousness/awareness might recede due to redundance/obsolescence? I mean, if everything is deterministic, then what's the point of awareness? sort of like RAM in a computer?
    ...the origin of emotional sickness lay in people’s belief that they were their personalities...
    "The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong." ~Carl Jung

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    Member mark esparza's Avatar
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    Maybe I am just dumb but, I do not see how a person who does not believe in free will or if free will did not exist, how it suggests hypothetical's would not be entertained. Your response as well as mine is to be expected.

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    tsuj a notelpmis QuickTwist's Avatar
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    I made a thread about determinism when I first got here. Check it out if you want.
    But your individuality and your present need will be swept away by change,
    and what you now ardently desire will one day become the object of abhorrence.
    ~ Schiller - 'Psychological Types'

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    Homo siderius Sistamatic's Avatar
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    A link to aforementioned thread: http://forums.intpcomplex.com/showth...on-Determinism

    @mark esparza Welcome to the forum! Free will tends to come up as a side topic in ... well a lot of things. Don't hesitate to add your thoughts to existing threads, and don't let this scare you off from creating new ones in the future. We don't have a policy against continuing old conversations, just sometimes we don't feel like repeating what we already said.

    A tangential subject here in a recent thread:

    http://forums.intpcomplex.com/showth...er-people-have

    Here's another tangential thread to play in:

    http://forums.intpcomplex.com/showth...-compatibilism

    Enjoy!
    Insults are effective only where emotion is present. -- Spock, "Who Mourns for Adonais?" Stardate 3468.1.

    I'm not avoiding socializing I'm helping socializing avoid me! --MoneyJungle

  6. #6
    Dr.Awkward Robcore's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mark esparza View Post
    Maybe I am just dumb but, I do not see how a person who does not believe in free will or if free will did not exist, how it suggests hypothetical's would not be entertained. Your response as well as mine is to be expected.
    Well of course they'd be entertained if antecedent events led to them being entertained...but in the meta-view, once you accept determinism, hypotheticals are sort of pointless.
    ...the origin of emotional sickness lay in people’s belief that they were their personalities...
    "The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong." ~Carl Jung

  7. #7
    tsuj a notelpmis QuickTwist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robcore View Post
    Well of course they'd be entertained if antecedent events led to them being entertained...but in the meta-view, once you accept determinism, hypotheticals are sort of pointless.
    I view them to be a potential learning event. After all, the only way to improve is what you are exposed to...
    But your individuality and your present need will be swept away by change,
    and what you now ardently desire will one day become the object of abhorrence.
    ~ Schiller - 'Psychological Types'

  8. #8
    Dr.Awkward Robcore's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by QuickTwist View Post
    I view them to be a potential learning event. After all, the only way to improve is what you are exposed to...
    Hypotheticals, by their very nature, are not based on reality...so what you learn from them is...what exactly?
    ...the origin of emotional sickness lay in people’s belief that they were their personalities...
    "The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong." ~Carl Jung

  9. #9
    tsuj a notelpmis QuickTwist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robcore View Post
    Hypotheticals, by their very nature, are not based on reality...so what you learn from them is...what exactly?
    What if we are living in a matrix???
    But your individuality and your present need will be swept away by change,
    and what you now ardently desire will one day become the object of abhorrence.
    ~ Schiller - 'Psychological Types'

  10. #10
    Dr.Awkward Robcore's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by QuickTwist View Post
    What if we are living in a matrix???
    That's the difference between a hypothesis, and a hypothetical.
    A hypothesis is meant to be scrutinized...a hypothetical is not.
    With a hypothetical, you take it to be true, and imagine what might follow from those conditions.
    With a hypothesis, you set out to determine whether or not it is true.

    Subtle difference, but important.
    ...the origin of emotional sickness lay in people’s belief that they were their personalities...
    "The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong." ~Carl Jung

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