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Thread: Child safety

  1. #21
    know nothing pensive_pilgrim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BarIII View Post
    Break the right things and you may live your last decades in constant pain. Or even your entire life. Or you could die. Kids don't need that.
    Pain is better than fear.

  2. #22
    Dr.Awkward Robcore's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sloth View Post
    Right, perspective is important. It isn't necessary to adult life to learn how to use a trampoline.
    It isn't necessary to adult life to be a carpenter, or to be a welder, or to do anything physical, really. You could just trade stocks. It isn't about the necessity of risk, it is about a degree of risk being acceptable without having to induce anxiety.
    ...the origin of emotional sickness lay in people’s belief that they were their personalities...
    "The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong." ~Carl Jung

  3. #23
    Faster. Than. Ever. Sloth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pensive_pilgrim View Post
    Pain is better than fear.
    That's pretty broad. I don't think that's true for every case. I think it really depends on the degrees of pain and fear, and the general risk/benefit ratio of the situation.

  4. #24
    Faster. Than. Ever. Sloth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robcore View Post
    It isn't necessary to adult life to be a carpenter, or to be a welder, or to do anything physical, really. You could just trade stocks. It isn't about the necessity of risk, it is about a degree of risk being acceptable without having to induce anxiety.
    Would you care to elaborate on how jumping up and down repetitively in a tiny confined place is deeply developmentally enriching enough to risk your child's ability to walk?

  5. #25
    Dr.Awkward Robcore's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxyjen View Post
    I'm not arguing that having those restrictive rules are necessarily the best thing, but I understand why administrators think it will make their jobs easier, from a legal, staff training, and parent coddling perspective.
    Yeah, it's necessary in a litigious climate. It really kills freedom, though. I mean, the same thing happens in construction these days...excessive rules so that companies can cover their butts in the case of an accident. Previously, workers had to fight for safety, and now it is being shoved down their throats.
    Eventually we'll strike a balance...but it's a while down the road, yet, I think.

    Hard to issue intelligent circumstantial rules without requiring everyone subject to said rules to be a lawyer, basically.
    ...the origin of emotional sickness lay in people’s belief that they were their personalities...
    "The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong." ~Carl Jung

  6. #26
    Dr.Awkward Robcore's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sloth View Post
    Would you care to elaborate on how jumping up and down repetitively in a tiny confined place is deeply developmentally enriching enough to risk your child's ability to walk?
    Our trampoline is 14 feet wide.
    Jumping on a trampoline is a blast...just like riding a bike...or swimming...or rowing a kayak....a few more things that are definitely not necessary...and can result in severe injury and/or death. My kids all have fantastic agility and balance...surely due in part to having experienced things like trampolining, scootering, skate boarding, cycling, kayaking, swimming, etc.
    The thing is, that doing nothing risky is definitely key to having a non-enriched life, while doing some risky things is enjoyable even though dangerous. I don't have the magic answer re: what the right amount of risk is...but I'm sure that the right amount is greater than zero.
    ...the origin of emotional sickness lay in people’s belief that they were their personalities...
    "The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong." ~Carl Jung

  7. #27
    Faster. Than. Ever. Sloth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robcore View Post
    The thing is, that doing nothing risky is definitely key to having a non-enriched life, while doing some risky things is enjoyable even though dangerous.
    I agree with this principle, as I've already said:

    Quote Originally Posted by Sloth View Post
    It's important for kids to be allowed to take risks
    Some risks are particularly extreme though. It's also a risk to run out into traffic but that's something we engrain into little kids to not do ever.

    There aren't thousands upon thousands of medical professionals telling people to not teach their kid to ride a bike, or to skateboard, or do those other things you listed. There are an overwhelming amount of them stating that children under 6 shouldn't be on trampolines.

    This isn't about the principle of allowing risk, it's about children under the age of 6 not being on trampolines.

  8. #28
    Dr.Awkward Robcore's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sloth View Post
    I agree with this principle, as I've already said:



    Some risks are particularly extreme though. It's also a risk to run out into traffic but that's something we engrain into little kids to not do ever.

    There aren't thousands upon thousands of medical professionals telling people to not teach their kid to ride a bike, or to skateboard, or do those other things you listed. There are an overwhelming amount of them stating that children under 6 shouldn't be on trampolines.

    This isn't about the principle of allowing risk, it's about children under the age of 6 not being on trampolines.
    Not all children under the age of six are created equally. Like I said earlier, our GP recommended waiting until around 8 months or older to start using the Jolly Jumper...but my kids, like myself, were bored of it by 7 months. Blanket rules are not what is best for everyone...even if they are what's best for some people.
    When I was a kid we sat in the front seat, without airbags or booster seats...sat in our parents' laps...now thousands of advocates want kids in car seats rear-facing for a really long time, then front facing for another long time, and then in booster seats up to an age where at one time, kids were having their own kids.
    I acknowledge the risk...but reject the blanket application of it. It varies on a case by case basis.
    ...the origin of emotional sickness lay in people’s belief that they were their personalities...
    "The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong." ~Carl Jung

  9. #29
    Faster. Than. Ever. Sloth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robcore View Post
    It varies on a case by case basis.
    The thing about some risks is that you don't always know what rules make sense to apply until it's too late. Most of the neighborhood kids that used the trampoline my neighbors had didn't get hurt, but one kid got very hurt and was hospitalized for a few days (I forget his exact injuries).

    Life is about risks and managing them, undoubtedly, but part of managing them is being honest about the risk benefit ratio of a particular action. I think the same level of enjoyment and "risk experience" can be achieved by doing a variety of other things (like the other stuff you listed) that doesn't disproportionately risk a kid's ability to walk. Again, I just don't see how being able to jump up and down repetitively in a confined space is more enriching than the other activities you listed, particularly with the greater amount of risk involved.

    Anyway, you have the internet and the ability to google "are trampolines safe" and read about its disproportionate risk.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robcore View Post
    Not all children under the age of six are created equally. Like I said earlier, our GP recommended waiting until around 8 months or older to start using the Jolly Jumper...but my kids, like myself, were bored of it by 7 months. Blanket rules are not what is best for everyone...even if they are what's best for some people.
    When I was a kid we sat in the front seat, without airbags or booster seats...sat in our parents' laps...now thousands of advocates want kids in car seats rear-facing for a really long time, then front facing for another long time, and then in booster seats up to an age where at one time, kids were having their own kids.
    I acknowledge the risk...but reject the blanket application of it. It varies on a case by case basis.
    It sounds like if you listened to the doctor the Jolly Jumper would be new to your kids at 8 months and they wouldn't be bored. I don't see what made you think your kids were different at the time you started the Jolly Jumper early. They became different later because you put them at risk against the doctor's advice.

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