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Thread: The End of Roe v. Wade?

  1. #1
    Hasta Siempre Madrigal's Avatar
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    The End of Roe v. Wade?

    I didn't even realize it was coming to this.

    I thought this article was really good:

    The End of Roe v. Wade Was Easy to See Coming

    Presidential campaigns were only able to produce all these tepid white men because there were so many of them, a deep and deeply mediocre bench of Democrats willing to compromise and sell out women’s health at the first whiff of opposition. The excuse given to feminists was always that these men were only “personally” anti-choice, that their beliefs would not affect their actions. There is, of course, no such thing as a purely “personal” belief that someone else should be stripped of her constitutional rights. If these men’s bigotry was truly confined to the private sphere, they would not be advocating for it on a national platform.

    A reliable ally to the left would have come in handy. But the supposed vanguard of Real Leftism, throughout that 2016 election, was Bernie Sanders...
    Quote Originally Posted by Hephaestus View Post
    Heh. We've been here years now.

  2. #2
    Cooler than Jesus
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    It doesn't seem possible, but neither did Trump's presidency. I dunno, this country is a nightmare right now. And the worst thing is how much popular support there is for the direction we're going.

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    Minister of Love Roger Mexico's Avatar
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    Man, don't get me started on what a joke Bernie Sanders is.


    It's like he fell asleep at his desk some time in the 1970's and didn't wake up until like March of 2015, and then he decided to run for president.


    And people were going honest-to-God apeshit over this fucking putz (I mean, the way I would generally summarize my opinion of Bernie Sanders is "he seems like a nice man... but he is both definitely and literally too old for this shit, and he is, also, a total putz") like he was going to ride in and just save the whole country from the last several decades' worth of moral rot and catastrophic fecklessness.


    I kept saying "No, look, if this dude--this fucking senile geriatric nobody from fucking Vermont who none of you had heard of before a month ago--is supposed to be our last minute Great White Hope , then what that means is that we are all well and truly fucked. If this is the best we can do, we really might as well just give up, turn off the lights, and try to beat the traffic. There really is Nothing To See Here. God help us all."
    Quote Originally Posted by Ptah View Post
    No history, no exposition, no anecdote or argument changes the invariant: we are all human beings, and some humans are idiots.

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    Homo siderius Sistamatic's Avatar
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    A lot of people only voted for trump because of roe v. wade. If it is overturned, there will be one less outrage tool in the republican toolbox, and one more in the democrat one. It will have a significant effect on the political landscape. I am so tired of outrage based politics, but I think it's a sapient reality.

    Here's another angle on abortion... I'm at an age where I've got about a 1 in 10 chance of down's syndrome if I carry a child to term, and the chance keeps getting higher. If Roe v. wade is overturned, previously passed legislation in the state goes into effect that will prevent all abortions unless it can be proven that the mother is going to likely die without one, so not even 50 year olds would be permitted to get abortions unless they were going to die without one. (One could drive out of state though, provided they had the means.)

    I had been planning to let menopause play out. I'm in the beginning stages already. But since no birth control method is 100 percent effective, and since I can afford it, I am going to get a ligation and ablation. This way I cannot possibly be forced to have a baby no matter what happens politically. I can afford the voluntary and therefore not covered by insurance surgery now, and this way I'll be safe from being forced into motherhood even if something terrible happens and I'm poverty stricken and homeless or something. I can't be certain, but I think that if I was as young as 30 and Roe v. Wade was overturned, I'd pursue this course of action anyway. It would be hard to find a doctor willing to ligate a 30 year old woman, but there's bound to be one somewhere. It's not like it's illegal. At 47, they don't even ask if you are sure. They just refer you to the scheduling department.
    Insults are effective only where emotion is present. -- Spock, "Who Mourns for Adonais?" Stardate 3468.1.

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  5. #5
    know nothing pensive_pilgrim's Avatar
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    Well maybe if they wanted the constitution to protect abortions they should have passed a constitutional amendment protecting abortions, rather than "interpreting" the 14th amendment that way and leaving that protection dependent on the supreme court forever upholding the same interpretation.

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    When I was younger this would have upset me a lot more. But a lot of young people are too lazy to vote, others were too idealistic to vote for Hilary, and a lot of them are ok with the erosion of abortion rights. Hell, young women today won't even call themselves feminists. All that shit has consequences. So far, the only tangible consequence of the Trump presidency for me is that I'm paying less taxes. At least if Roe v. Wade is overturned we won't have to listen to men whine about how when they got their girlfriend pregnant they couldn't force her to have an abortion against her will. They'll probably still whine about paying child support though.

    Anyway, abortion is only a plane ticket away. I can use some of my saved tax money if it comes to that. But it probably won't because I'm old and will be on hormone suppressants for probably the rest of my life.

  7. #7
    Homo siderius Sistamatic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by starla View Post
    When I was younger this would have upset me a lot more. But a lot of young people are too lazy to vote, others were too idealistic to vote for Hilary, and a lot of them are ok with the erosion of abortion rights. Hell, young women today won't even call themselves feminists. All that shit has consequences. So far, the only tangible consequence of the Trump presidency for me is that I'm paying less taxes. At least if Roe v. Wade is overturned we won't have to listen to men whine about how when they got their girlfriend pregnant they couldn't force her to have an abortion against her will. They'll probably still whine about paying child support though.

    Anyway, abortion is only a plane ticket away. I can use some of my saved tax money if it comes to that. But it probably won't because I'm old and will be on hormone suppressants for probably the rest of my life.
    I wonder if the average age of ligation will go down if roe v. wade is overturned, and if, in turn, the next thing the fundies will go after is the right to a ligation.
    Insults are effective only where emotion is present. -- Spock, "Who Mourns for Adonais?" Stardate 3468.1.

    I'm not avoiding socializing I'm helping socializing avoid me! --MoneyJungle

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sistamatic View Post
    I wonder if the average age of ligation will go down if roe v. wade is overturned, and if, in turn, the next thing the fundies will go after is the right to a ligation.
    They already tell women they shouldn't take measures to avoid getting pregnant. In their world it is always a man's decision what a woman does with her reproductive tract. Either her dad, her husband, or the church elders if there is nobody else. I don't think they'll stop until the US is practicing the fundie equivalent of sharia law. It's ironic that they don't see the parallels between themselves and muslim fundamentalists.

    I think moderates would have a harder time swallowing this though. If trump were as openly dogmatic as pence, he probably would have been written off as the nutjob that he his. But I think a lot of (stupid) people thought he wasn't really as conservative as he was pretending to be, he was just acting that way to get elected. And guess what, he still is! I don't know how people who voted for him or stayed home aren't regretting their decision now. But to be fair, like I said, the only direct impact on my life so far is that I pay less in taxes. So his presidency hasn't been a disaster for me personally, yet.

  9. #9
    silent magician lv. 4 slush puppie's Avatar
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    i was actually most upset at Justice Kennedy.

    i am fortunate enough to live in perhaps the most progressive state, but i still often wonder what the hell i am doing in America. it is increasingly no place for someone like me...

    the Democrats are sellouts and a half-dozen other things, yes, but they're still loads better than the fundie, KKK Reds. we are fighting to keep our state Blue this November, as well as for that federal congressional Blue Wave.

    by this logic, though, very few places in the world are for me. i wonder what kind of culture they'll have on Mars...
    Last edited by slush puppie; 07-08-2018 at 06:00 PM.
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  10. #10
    Homo siderius Sistamatic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by starla View Post
    They already tell women they shouldn't take measures to avoid getting pregnant. In their world it is always a man's decision what a woman does with her reproductive tract. Either her dad, her husband, or the church elders if there is nobody else. I don't think they'll stop until the US is practicing the fundie equivalent of sharia law. It's ironic that they don't see the parallels between themselves and muslim fundamentalists.
    It's really hard for people to accept that a woman doesn't want to be a mom. At around 40, people stop practically begging you to hurry up and have kids and instead start asking you why you didn't, often with trepidation, like they are expecting a story of multiple heartbreaks. Lately when the subject of grandkids comes up, as it often does with folks my age, I get a lot of sympathetic clucking as if everyone is certain it must be too painful for me to talk about how empty my childless devastation of a lifetime has been, and they are less likely to pry into the why of it for fear I'll have a hysterical breakdown over my unbearable (see what I did there) tragedy. People just can't wrap their heads around a woman who WANTS to be child free.

    Here's an article about how it can take many many years to find a doctor willing to ligate a woman under 35, even if she's already got kids.
    https://www.chatelaine.com/health/ca...ubal-ligation/

    It's worth mentioning that while it is far far easier for a young childless man to get a vasectomy, it is still stigmatized.
    Insults are effective only where emotion is present. -- Spock, "Who Mourns for Adonais?" Stardate 3468.1.

    I'm not avoiding socializing I'm helping socializing avoid me! --MoneyJungle

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