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Thread: 2020 Presidential race

  1. #1081
    Member aiyanah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fitz View Post
    blah blah blah blah

    More worthless rambling.

    I'm an American living in America. Maybe you should focus on fixing your shit instead of spewing propaganda about shit you don't understand.
    I've got you covered, should read that shit before displaying your programming.

  2. #1082
    Member aiyanah's Avatar
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    https://cbs58.com/news/woman-gave-bi...0burned%20down.

    Look man, if it's this easy to put you in deep waters in regards to what is happening in your own country and make you close your eyes and ears to anything that is contra to what you wanted to hear...well you have far bigger problems than what some random on the internet tells you.

    it is not sane that you would deem news of a black woman's home getting burned down by the mob a propaganda piece, while at the same time espousing BLM and antifa bullshit.

    You don't get to have that one both ways, sorry you just don't.
    if I'm the bad guy for wanting the American left to be functional then so be it, I've been the bad guy before and I did not regret it.
    Pick which side of that left you are on because you cannot have it both ways.

  3. #1083
    Senior Member Starjots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aiyanah View Post
    also, the entire reason that america has it's gun laws is to safeguard from a military dictatorship, because the plan from the start with the USA was to become a military superpower, which it is now.
    The first part of your statement seems to be in the ball park - except the distrust was against large standing armies and kings. Military dictatorships weren't a thing back then except Oliver Cromwell, which was 100 years prior.

    The mention in the 2nd amendment of well organized militias is not a minor thing, nor a quirk of wording.

    But here we are 240 odd years later with the most powerful military on the planet. A will organized militia hasn't been a thing in at least a hundred and fifty years, probably more. (National Guard troops don't bring their own equipment from home, it is bought by the government).

    So LOGICALLY, the rationale for the 2nd amendment is now void. It needs to be re-examined. It no longer applies. A will organized militia has no meaning today because after WW2 we opted for the giant ass military.

    NOW - if you advocated for cutting the US military back down to a fraction of itself, cut it's funding 90% and go back to the militia model, gun rights advocates would be coherent to me.

    THE SECOND part of your statement is just bullshit. (and the following sentences too), but to state the idea that the US was designed to be a -military- superpower from the beginning, when we relied on militias in a contradiction. Etc.

  4. #1084
    Senior Member Starjots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aiyanah View Post
    if I'm the bad guy for wanting the American left to be functional then so be it, I've been the bad guy before and I did not regret it.
    So this is the rational choice, systematic racism or being functional? Things as they are or disfunction? This presumes things cannot improve or maybe there's no problem, I don't know.

    If that puts me on the 'LEFT' so be it. Are engineers and scientists LEFTISTS for looking to solve problems or learn new things? Bah.

  5. #1085
    schlemiel Faust's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jyng1 View Post
    It starts by passing a law. But you're right; this is probably illegal but Karen still pulls her gun on a couple of black girls, instead of it being just handbags at 10 paces...

    You should see the full video before passing judgment.

    Quote Originally Posted by roki View Post
    How is gun control as simple as passing a law?
    Insofar as that's what it is, legislated regulation, it's "simple", but getting it right, let alone passing it, is not simple.

    After the '89 shooting here we passed bill C-68. Guns have still been around, there's just more of a process for acquiring them which has been enough to keep incel-Chad from shooting up a school just by visiting a Walmart. Consequently, no significant incident until the NS shooting recently by an ex-military member, using illegal arms he got directly from America. Now we've got bullshit legislation on top of what already worked, as a campaign promise and in part an opportunistic response, that bans a long list of firearms using ambiguous cosmetic criteria. That will just hurt the party in the election.

    All of which to say C-68 had a sufficient impact. We've had an uptick in street level firearm homicide, but no one cares that much about gangland murder. The poverty isn't as deep here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Starjots
    So LOGICALLY, the rationale for the 2nd amendment is now void. It needs to be re-examined. It no longer applies. A will organized militia has no meaning today because after WW2 we opted for the giant ass military.
    The response to that would be that there's no less of a threat of tyranny from government and the population should be ready. You can quibble about its intended purpose but as far as current day politics goes it barely matters. I don't see what sort of meaningful ground there is to be gained here.

    I say go the other direction. There's been a recent push in some circles for black people to arm themselves, doing more gun advocacy, effectively embracing the right. There's traction potential, popular adoption of such a view would eliminate the partisanship problem. Plenty of single issue voters among Republicans, we've just created new ones in Canada. I don't see a real downside.

    @Fitz, seems there's no point engaging the troll. If you shove their bullshit in their face they just change the subject and resort to more non sequiturs. They're not interested in being consistent, let alone debate. Just hurling nonsense.
    Last edited by Faust; Yesterday at 05:09 PM.

  6. #1086
    Member aiyanah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starjots View Post
    The first part of your statement seems to be in the ball park - except the distrust was against large standing armies and kings. Military dictatorships weren't a thing back then except Oliver Cromwell, which was 100 years prior.

    The mention in the 2nd amendment of well organized militias is not a minor thing, nor a quirk of wording.

    But here we are 240 odd years later with the most powerful military on the planet. A will organized militia hasn't been a thing in at least a hundred and fifty years, probably more. (National Guard troops don't bring their own equipment from home, it is bought by the government).

    So LOGICALLY, the rationale for the 2nd amendment is now void. It needs to be re-examined. It no longer applies. A will organized militia has no meaning today because after WW2 we opted for the giant ass military.

    NOW - if you advocated for cutting the US military back down to a fraction of itself, cut it's funding 90% and go back to the militia model, gun rights advocates would be coherent to me.

    THE SECOND part of your statement is just bullshit. (and the following sentences too), but to state the idea that the US was designed to be a -military- superpower from the beginning, when we relied on militias in a contradiction. Etc.
    the evolution of mlitia's is what? a full blown military, organised not only across the country by various bases, but globally with offshore bases and deployments too.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United...ry_deployments

    there is a reason i refer to america as the modern babylon, it is the center of the world right now, that is no accident.
    one cannot have expansionist ambitions without a dedicated military force, as was learned way back when.

    Quote Originally Posted by Starjots View Post
    So this is the rational choice, systematic racism or being functional? Things as they are or disfunction? This presumes things cannot improve or maybe there's no problem, I don't know.

    If that puts me on the 'LEFT' so be it. Are engineers and scientists LEFTISTS for looking to solve problems or learn new things? Bah.
    the scientists and engineers are mostly leftist, yes, they corrupt the sciences in order to gain political traction for their handlers and paymasters.
    that's documented by some of the few who remain loyal to the original ethos of science, yet goes unheard cause the media is also a part of the political apparatus.
    but i digress they're simply a symptom of where society is at and not why it is where it's at.

    there is no systematic racism btw.
    what you are pointing to are cultural failings within the american negro community, but rather than fix those cause that would take actual effort and truth, you sell a lie, or perhaps you bought someone else's lie.
    ok...good to know.
    you would do well to find the negro dark web (not it's actual name) and listen to what they have to say about the cultural failings within the community.
    black guy starts a business in the hood? everyone wants a hand out, the gangsters come by and rob the place, suddenly there is no business.
    rinse and repeat, it is a cycle with no end for as long as truth is shelved for narrative.
    must be systematic racism that did it though innit.
    i've elucidated on this in other threads on this board but i cba to lift it here.

  7. #1087
    Senior Member jyng1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faust View Post
    You should see the full video before passing judgment.
    I did. A minor dispute escalated to threatening to use lethal force because someone had a concealed carry permit. If it was handbags at 10 paces Karen and Ken wouldn't have their mugshots plastered in every news outlet in the western world.

    I dunno about the US but here the level of force used self defence can only be proportionate to the threat posed (you wouldn't get a gun licence if you said you wanted it for defence). Someone sitting in a car being yelled at by a couple of pedestrians wouldn't even be at risk of breaking a nail.

    Even the cops have been told they must include a TEN-R assessment in every use of force report.

  8. #1088
    凸(ಠ_ರೃ )凸 stuck's Avatar
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    Cali has strict laws about brandishing guns, the fact that they went for the felonious assault charge probably means the gun was loaded when they apprehended them. I'm guessing they'll plea bargain and do a couple months in the clink.

  9. #1089
    Senior Member Starjots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faust View Post
    The response to that would be that there's no less of a threat of tyranny from government and the population should be ready. You can quibble about its intended purpose but as far as current day politics goes it barely matters. I don't see what sort of meaningful ground there is to be gained here.
    The protection against government tyranny isn't what is in the constitution. That's an after the fact just so story.

    Case in point - The Whisky Rebellion. This happened during the term of George Washington, within a few years of the Constitution being approved. Some Pennsylvania farmers thought the government was being tyrannical, got armed and violent and were - suppressed. How does that fit into the 2nd amendment being about protecting against government tyranny?

    As far as barely matters, well, since a sizeable minority believe(or a majority) in guns like they believe in Jesus, yes it barely matters. And, I also agree what actually matters are things as they are now as opposed to what was happening in 1785.

    Since this is a presidential race thread - I'll also say it is unwise to mess with this issue too much. I more interested in a functional government first.

  10. #1090
    Senior Member Starjots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by C.J.Woolf View Post
    I read that most of the rally attendees were locals, and that makes sense to me. Imagine you're a Trump supporter who would have to travel to Tulsa. There were three disincentives to make the trip:

    1. The news that tickets exceeded the arena's capacity by a factor of 10+. Why travel when the odds are poor you'll get in?

    2. Warnings from the Trump campaign that Antifa would show up in numbers. Do you really want to fight to get in?

    3. COVID-19. Do you really want to risk getting sick for this?

    The latter two applied to locals as well, though I suppose anyone paying attention to social media could have seen that there was plenty of room and no Antifa early enough to go.
    Last mention in this thread of COVID, almost two weeks ago. Given the recent developments (cases spiking ), do you (general you) think this might impact the election?

    New Cases July 3rd by state top 10, rounded to nearest 100 and 7 day moving average positive rate (5% or less is okay).
    FL 9500 19.5% positive rate
    TX 7300 14.7% positive rate
    CA 4500 8.9% positive rate
    AZ 4400 29.6% positive rate (holy shit)
    GA 2800 12.3% positive rate
    NC 2000 5.6% positive rate
    SC 1800 15.5%
    TN 1800 7.7%
    AL 1800 19.9%
    LA 1700 9.0%

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