Page 2 of 7 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 64

Thread: Autism, Empathy and Mental-Health(?), Oh My!

  1. #11
    chaotic neutral shitpost jigglypuff's Avatar
    Type
    xxxx
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    shrubland
    Posts
    8,636
    so much casual diagnosing happens on this forum. if you believe you or someone requires therapy or treatment, a CORRECT diagnosis is required to get (benefits from) that.

    it’s also possible to be formally misdiagnosed with autism. i know of it happening with cptsd

  2. #12
    Senior Member Sinny's Avatar
    Type
    INTP
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Birmingham, UK
    Posts
    5,949
    Quote Originally Posted by Sistamatic View Post
    The "autism as a spectrum" thing comes into play too. It's a broad label, like "candy." We all get that peanut butter cups and licorice fall under the same label of "candy" despite being very very different things.

    My typical friend/acquaintance diagnoses have come about as a result of (among other things) the following:

    -Things go over my head because I'm too literal. Sometimes I don't get a joke because of this. Sometimes I think people are asserting ridiculous things. Age and experience has mitigated these issues significantly, but if I was to go with my initial read on things the way I did when I was younger, I'd get lots of blank stares. Sentences are puzzles where I have to figure out what was meant vs. what was actually said. Ex: It pains me greatly to "F up" (as in add all the feelery shit) to my emails and letters because why the fuck would I call a business contact "Dear" and there is nothing "sincere" about all the f-ups I've added to a document, so I feel like I'm lying when I close with, "sincerely."

    -I can't multitask at all. Whatever I'm doing, that's what I'm doing. Ex: when playing dungeons and dragons, I have to leave the room to level up my character because I can't think about what everyone is saying and level my character up at the same time. I have to tune everyone out to read spell descriptions during gameplay. I need a single datastream coming into my head or it all becomes noise. Age and wisdom does not improve this, but I am better at hiding it by timing my tune-outs so that I am missing less important stuff.

    -I'm fairly face blind. I remember people by context, and when a person is out of context, I have trouble recognizing them. Sometimes this is true even if I've known them a long time but only in one narrow context. i.e. I won't recognize a coworker outside of the workplace, or a neighbor outside the neighborhood.

    -It is unnatural for me to exchange greetings. I once told my husband that I'd gotten way better at saying "hi" back to people when they greet me and he laughed. So apparently not.

    -I am not very good at discerning the passive aggressive content of things said to me, nor am I very good at making sure there is no unintended hidden messaging in the things I say. This often leaves me feeling as if me and the person I'm conversing with are having two entirely different conversations. My husband says it's hilarious when someone straight up insults me and I fail to notice and even more hilarious when I straight up insult someone and fail to notice.

    -not sure how to put this thing into words, so I'll just give my friends' most oft cited examples: 1) Man comes into the yard and offers to trim my sweetgum. I say, "That's not a sweetgum." He gets mad and storms off. I don't understand what I did wrong, but everyone else, upon hearing the story thinks I did something hilarious. 2) man at zoo tells his kid that a scarlet kingsnake (a harmless snake) is the deadliest snake in all of Texas. I say, "No it's not." When he argued, I explained my credentials (herpetology degree) and gave him and his son a rundown of how to identify all the actually venomous snakes in Texas. I thought it went well. It was years ago. My husband and his friend who witnessed it to this day tell the story, and when they do, people just howl with laughter. I accept that it must be hilarious, and have even taken to telling the story for laughs, but I really don't get it. I mean I can parse that you aren't supposed to inform people who are objectively, blatantly wrong that they are wrong, but I just can't understand why.

    I very much need the benefit of the doubt to have meaningful relationships with people.
    It could be said that some of those things resemble the very nature of the indentified "INTP", for example, as an INTP I have little interest on social frivolities and might be apt to correct somebody when they are wrong...

    However, unlike Rev, I do appreciate that's it's a custom and manners, to greet people when they greet you, to correct them in a non condescending or patronising manner, and not to talk over, interrupt or turn my back on people when they are speaking to me.

    This is something he struggles with though, which is hard to come to terms with when these things come so naturally to me, also an anti-social know-it-all by nature.

    In regards to the multitasking, Rev struggles so much that he sometimes stops walking in order to talk, or has to stop a mindless activity to focus his attention else where; such as when doing the dishes, laundry or any other mundane, thoughtless task.

    I can understand not being able to focus on something intellectual or complex at the same time as diverting your attention elsewhere, but mindless tasks really?!

    Really.

    I find myself doing the task I was doing, taking over the task he was doing, tending to the baby and leading the conversation whilst he's still processing the change in what's happening.

    It's said/rumoured that the model of "men being from Mars and women from Venus" was rooted in the relationship dynamics of a female NT and a male Aspie, because the two are so far removed.

    A few days ago, I followed him out to his car when he was on his way to work. I was trying to tell him that I had such a bad nights sleep (no sleep, completely stressed) and that I wasn't going to make it through the day. He was running late for work himself so barely paid attention to what I said, he then sprayed his window screen and gave me a face full of anti-freeze, which literally went in my eyes & mouth. He didn't notice this despite me spluttering in front of him. I told him so, and he still didn't acknowledge me. He told me he was running late for work and had to go.

    I seethingly retreated and then it wasn't until I mentioned the de-icer about 3 times later throughout the day, that he finally acknowledged what had happened and apologised.

    Incidentally, I was so tired I really struggled to care for the baby that day, thankfully, about 3pm she joined me for a day time nap (that I never ever usually take), that lasted until Rev got home at 6pm.

    I was pleading for his help that morning, something I have never done or asked before, and yet it fell on deaf ears and all I got was a face full of anti-freeze.

    The icing on the cake is that he doesn't understand why that would make somebody mad.

    I didn't even bother expressing how mad I was because it would just be a wasted on a person who's incapable of understanding.
    All truth passes through three stages:

    First, it is ridiculed.
    Second, it is violently opposed.
    Third, it is accepted as self-evident.


  3. #13
    Senior Member roki's Avatar
    Type
    isfp
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Posts
    3,446
    If his interests aren't limited and he doesn't have a problem with routine, think about ADHD as an inhouse diagnosis. The two disorders tend to overlap in the spots you've described, although it's possible they're comorbid
    god's gift

  4. #14
    Senior Member Sinny's Avatar
    Type
    INTP
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Birmingham, UK
    Posts
    5,949
    Quote Originally Posted by roki View Post
    If his interests aren't limited and he doesn't have a problem with routine, think about ADHD as an inhouse diagnosis. The two disorders tend to overlap in the spots you've described, although it's possible they're comorbid
    I'm already pretty sure he has ADD comorbid. He seems to think so too, at least he doesn't deny it and seems to entertain the idea. (Of having ADD)
    All truth passes through three stages:

    First, it is ridiculed.
    Second, it is violently opposed.
    Third, it is accepted as self-evident.


  5. #15
    Homo siderius Sistamatic's Avatar
    Type
    INTP
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    6,638
    Quote Originally Posted by pensive_pilgrim View Post
    You're probably just putting it bluntly when most people would use a little tact. Not understanding how people can be embarrassed at being informed that they're wrong indicates lack of empathy which I think is supposed to be an autistic trait.


    We all do, especially on the occasions where we least deserve it. I would frame it differently and say "we need to look for the best in people to have any hope of finding it".
    Ah, the Pollyanna principle.

    My mom and grandma went on and on about "the golden rule" when I was little, and in my deliberate effort to apply it I discovered that other than the obvious stuff like not hitting people and not taking people's stuff, most people don't want to be treated the way I want to be treated.

    I don't know, in spite of my need for massive piles of time by myself, I don't need to look to find good things about almost everyone I bother to get to know. I think the main reason I'm an obligate introvert is that I always tended to ignore the bad things about people to the point where it got me in trouble on a number of occasions. I suck at understanding the motives of others, and I almost never err in the direction of ascribing worse-than-actual motives. Despite having been burned many times, I still default to "he/she means well." I do this because I almost universally mean well in everything that I do, but the reality of it is that sometimes people mean to harm. I have been harmed intentionally or willfully many times and I STILL don't assume it even when I really should. I have to add in unnatural subroutines to remind myself that people aren't always good.

    Like with sweetgum dude. I assume he honestly just wanted to make a little side cash but after getting burned by side hires a few times, I now don't hire anyone who isn't bonded and insured and in business. I didn't want to embarrass him, but it was not a sweetgum. I would have wanted to know that in his position, but I'm so pedantic that I'd probably have keyed out the tree just to make sure before I dared utter what species it was, lol. Had he responded by saying, "Oh, my bad, you're right, that's an oak tree. Here's my business card, I'm a bonded and insured tree trimmer, check me out on the better business bureau," I might have hired him. I do need some tree trimming done. Other conversations with random solicitors in my yard selling services I need do tend to go something like, "Are you bonded and insured? What's your business number? Do you have a card? How long have you been in business?" These are pieces of data I need to determine if someone is going to sue me if they fall out of my tree, if they are going to do the work they are paid to do, etc. I know that it is considered socially awkward to ask these kinds of questions because it assumes that someone may not be honest, but sometimes you just have to assume that a person is not honest. If you are selling tree services, you need to be thick skinned enough to handle that sort of stuff.

    As for the guy in the zoo...well ok, maybe I embarrassed him initially. Despite his initial irritation the rest of the conversation went well, but that part doesn't enter into the jokes. I mean by the time we were done he seemed really happy with how the whole thing went. My initial approach was awkward, but if I'd been unwilling to point out he was wrong, we never could have had the whole exchange, and in this case, his kid got to have a one on one interaction with a herpetologist at the reptile exhibit at the zoo. I thought I was being incredibly social and friendly...until we got to the car and my husband and his friend started in on it. Husband in exaggerated Tex-ASS accent: "Now this right here is the deadliest snake in all of Texas*." His friend in a deadpan imitation of the rain man. "No it's not." Then they howl with laughter. Rinse and repeat every time they have beers for the rest of our lives.

    Aside: we were not in Texas when this happened. That's the only part of this that is funny to me. In fact, I thought that was the whole joke at first.
    Insults are effective only where emotion is present. -- Spock, "Who Mourns for Adonais?" Stardate 3468.1.

    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -- Aristotle

    This SEP field is glorious!

  6. #16
    Now we know... Asteroids Champion ACow's Avatar
    Type
    INTP
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    2,964
    Just like PMS, autism does actually exist (for functional definitions of exists, not withstanding the whole general behavioral diagnosis vs pathology problem in psychology).

    But the analogy I'm drawing is that just like when a man (or woman) dismisses another because "must be that time of the month", so too is it common that an attempt of "are you autistic/on the spectrum" is not an actual diagnosis, but merely another way of delegitimising what is otherwise the phenomenon of general disagreement/conflict/emotional states/opinion/ culture.

    Have at thee!

  7. #17
    Ieilaelite pensive_pilgrim's Avatar
    Type
    INTP
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    5,685
    Quote Originally Posted by jigglypuff View Post
    so much casual diagnosing happens on this forum. if you believe you or someone requires therapy or treatment, a CORRECT diagnosis is required to get (benefits from) that.

    it’s also possible to be formally misdiagnosed with autism. i know of it happening with cptsd
    I've been "formally diagnosed" with so many different things now. ADD, bipolar, schizophrenia, schizoaffective, borderline, and on and on. The DSM is more open to interpretation than the bible. Psychiatry is gonna end up next to alchemy in the history books.

  8. #18
    Senior Member Sinny's Avatar
    Type
    INTP
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Birmingham, UK
    Posts
    5,949
    Quote Originally Posted by pensive_pilgrim View Post
    I've been "formally diagnosed" with so many different things now. ADD, bipolar, schizophrenia, schizoaffective, borderline, and on and on. The DSM is more open to interpretation than the bible. Psychiatry is gonna end up next to alchemy in the history books.
    I'd suggest you get a better therapist then, because many of those things are vastllllyyyy different, and unless you're the most screwed up person on the planet, I fail to see how you could be diagnosed with all of them.

    Theoretically, they could be co-mormid, but you'd be a statistical diamond.
    All truth passes through three stages:

    First, it is ridiculed.
    Second, it is violently opposed.
    Third, it is accepted as self-evident.


  9. #19
    Senior Member Sinny's Avatar
    Type
    INTP
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Birmingham, UK
    Posts
    5,949
    Rev seems to think my sensitivity to light and sound is an indication not something other than just BPD, but I think my light sensitivity is completely unrelated to mental health, and although I am sensitive to noise I can pin point exactly where this come from in child-hood. (Trauma).
    All truth passes through three stages:

    First, it is ridiculed.
    Second, it is violently opposed.
    Third, it is accepted as self-evident.


  10. #20
    Homo siderius Sistamatic's Avatar
    Type
    INTP
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    6,638
    Quote Originally Posted by Sinny View Post
    It could be said that some of those things resemble the very nature of the indentified "INTP", for example, as an INTP I have little interest on social frivolities and might be apt to correct somebody when they are wrong...
    :nods: :shrugs: This really underscores what I was saying before. At my age, it doesn't matter why. It's just who/how I am. Maybe if I'd not been a kid in the 1970s AND had gotten a diagnosis at an early age, a label would be useful, but I already got stuck in what passed for learning disabled classes as a kid despite my iq tests contraindicating it, I already spent a childhood isolated from peers who thought there was something wrong with me, I already learned the hard way how to interact with others. Whatever is or isn't wrong, the damage and recovery from said damage is all past tense. The way I see it, there are two sides to the whatever this coin is. There are things my weirdness makes me very good at and I am extremely resilient to a lot of the emotional turmoil that seems to buffet the people around me. I'll take it, label or no. I'm happy with how it all turned out.
    Insults are effective only where emotion is present. -- Spock, "Who Mourns for Adonais?" Stardate 3468.1.

    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -- Aristotle

    This SEP field is glorious!

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •